Chinese philosopher and strategist Sun Tzu (b. 544 BC) said that “In the midst of chaos, there is also opportunity.” While 2020 was marred by catastrophe and inconvenience, the year also spurned growth and innovation. Businesses adapted their policies and products to accommodate an increasingly digitized world, as the work-from-home and stay-at-home models gained traction worldwide. At the individual level, people deprived of social activity and alienated from normal life took up new hobbies and creative pursuits — like cooking, gaming, working out, reading, writing, meditating, learning a language, pickleball, e-commerce and DIY projects — which meaningfully impacted their lives and those of the people around them.

One such lasting legacy came in the form of Vane Vainilla, a local cake shop based in Lima, Peru. Vane Vainilla’s founder and namesake, Vanessa Cisneros, attributes the business’s launch in February of 2021 to the stillness and quiet time of reflection she experienced during the previous year’s lockdown. During its first two years, the start-up has grown considerably, even as Vanessa doubles as a full-time Business Analyst. This week, she eagerly agreed to chat about her passion for baking, foray into the world of entrepreneurship, and plans to take her fledgling company to another level. The following is the account of a live 60-minute interview conducted remotely and translated into English. I trust you will find Vanessa’s answers and curated photos to be candid, insightful, and appetizing. You can follow Vane Vainilla on Instagram for a gallery of past work and future publications @vanevainillacakeshop

[For the complete archive of interviews, click here.]

Tell the people a little about yourself.

My name is Vanessa Cisneros. I’m 28 years old. I live in Lima, which is the capital of Peru, with my family and my cat, Tom. I currently work for a company in the organic farming and sustainability industries. In college, I studied administration with a focus on marketing, and I am responsible for all of our business marketing strategy. A fun fact about me is that I’m a big coffee drinker and I love frequenting coffee shops.  

How did your passion for baking grow?

I learned from conversations with my mom that I used to fashion small cakes with dirt when I was three years old and loved all activities that involved sweets. However, it was my grandmother’s influence that grew my love for baking most of all. When I was on vacation from school, I would stay at my grandmother’s house. My grandmother was always in the kitchen cooking up something delicious. In the evenings she would make flour cookies and cakes. When I was 9 years old, my grandmother taught me how to cook. I believe that experience motivated me to explore my love for the kitchen even further and expand on the things she taught me.

With that goal in mind, I convinced my mom to enroll me in baking classes at a local institute. I was about 12 or 13 at the time. I remember being the only young person in the program because they only let people who had finished high school enroll. However, they made an exception in my case on the condition that an adult accompanied me, and so my mom came along for the ride.

The program was for two years, but I only finished one year because it conflicted with my standard academic and volleyball schedules. In the end, I decided to prioritize those things over my love for baking. However, in that one year I learned a lot and gained enough of a foundation to experiment with various kinds of cakes that we did not get to cover.

What makes a good baker? How does baking differ from other culinary arts? 

I believe there is an inner passion that people who love to bake possess. It is the good feeling you get when you see others happy, and I believe sweets have that effect on people. When people are sad or want to celebrate, they typically like to eat something sweet like chocolate to elevate their mood. Sweets bring joy, and that joy inspires people to bake.

I also think my personality drew me to the art of baking. I’m a really creative person. I love doing unique things. For example, I love making unique cakes that can’t be replicated.

Are you yourself a sweet-tooth?

Absolutely. Two of my favorite desserts are Carrot Cake and Suspiro de Limeña, a famous Peruvian dish. It consists of a creamy, caramel-like pudding.   

You do Pilates and swim multiple times a week. How do you balance your love for sweets with your resolve to be healthy?

I believe life is all about balance. I find balance by exercising and making my consumption of sweets a special occasion. For the last five years, I haven’t consumed sugary drinks or added sugar in any other context. But I give myself the pleasure of enjoying desserts to fulfill the need I have for something sweet in my life.

When did you start Vane Vanilla?

It was a year after the pandemic, in February of 2021. Prior to then, I would only make sweets for my family and friends. I always wanted to have a small business, but I didn’t know how to do it, and I didn’t have much time to invest because I was busy studying and working. However, when the pandemic happened and everything shut down, it gave me a time of stillness at home that brought that old dream in me back to life. That was when I decided to move forward with the idea.  

What does the menu at Vane Vanilla consist of?

Every kind of cake you can imagine. I also do cupcakes and cookies.

How do you acquire business?

I work full-time during the day, so I make time at night to take orders, and I schedule deliveries on the weekend. If a delivery is too urgent for my schedule, then I am unable to fulfill it. However, I do everything in my power to attend to people and their requests. It’s been a couple of years since we started, so I have a network of past customers that will often refer their family members and friends.

I also run Facebook ads that help me advertise the business. I plan to run a campaign in the next few weeks to generate more sales.

Do you plan on growing the business?

Right now Vane Vainilla is a small local business that only accepts on-demand orders. We don’t produce at scale or keep an inventory. Later on the plan is to have a shop where people can pick up pre-made cakes. I also want to expand our digital presence. I am working on getting a website set up to promote the business that might later accept online orders to be picked up locally in Lima.   

What has been your favorite baking experience? 

There is one order I particularly enjoyed because it was super challenging. The customer asked me to make a cake for Mother’s Day. But they wanted the cake to be like a pastel del novio [wedding-style], compact and delicious with dried fruit and raisins. I had just launched Vane Vainilla and run some ads on Facebook. This was one of the first orders I received, and I had never made a cake like this before. I ended up making two, just to be safe in case something went wrong. Luckily, both cakes turned out excellently, and my family and I got to enjoy the “plan b” at home. Overall, it was a fun, memorable experience to do something I had never done before.

What about your biggest baking fail? 

My biggest baking fail happened during a time when we were unusually busy and my mind was distracted. I made some cupcakes with merengue italiano [sweetened egg whites]. The merengue italiano contains egg and so if it isn’t refrigerated it melts. I had the order ready to be delivered but I forgot to put it in the refrigerator. When I got home, I realized that the egg whites had melted one hour before the delivery. I called the customer and let them know the order was going to be delayed because I had to make it afresh. I gifted them some extra cupcakes for the inconvenience and to help hold them over.

In the end, everything turned out okay. The moral of the story is to double-check that everything is in the right place.

This is the rapid-fire round. I’m going to ask you several questions in quick succession. You can limit your answers to no more than a few words or sentences.

Hardest baked good to make? 

Pastel de novio [Peruvian wedding cake] due to the compact texture.  

Favorite non-baked good to eat? 

Lomo saltado [traditional Peruvian stir-fry].

Spirit animal? 

A cat. Cats are independent and highly intelligent.

Ideal weather? 

Rainy and about 12 degrees Celsius [~54 degrees Fahrenheit].

Favorite Peruvian celebrity? 

Mario Vargas Llosa. He is a Nobel-winning Peruvian novelist.

Favorite foreign celebrity? 

Sameer Gadhia, the lead singer of Young the Giant.  

Country you most want to visit? 

Australia.

Dream occupation? 

Fashion designer.

Hidden talent? 

I make hand-made clothing designs.

If you could have one superpower, what would it be? 

To be able to read minds.

Something people don’t know about you? 

I’m an open book, I think they know everything!

Saying or motto you live by? 

If I don’t do it, nobody else will. My actions will ultimate determine where I end up in life. No one else can take them for me.

Where do you envision yourself in the future, both personally and professionally?

Professionally, I’d like to apply the knowledge I’ve learned from my career to transform Vane Vanilla from a local to a national business. I envision myself working for Vane Vainilla as a manager/administrator overseeing a larger operation. Personally, I’d like to travel and tour various countries. I also want to start a family.

Every year I conquer a fear. Last year I went surfing in Makaha and Los Yuyos, and it was the craziest fear I’ve conquered to date. A fear I want to conquer in the future is the fear of working for myself full-time at Vane Vainilla. Let’s hope one day I can make it a reality!

Passion inspires people, and people who are passionate about things inspire others. I have found that whenever my friends were passionate about something—whether it was world football, real estate, or the subject matter today—they inspired me to get to know more about it, even if I had no prior experience with it. I’m not ashamed to admit that of all the subject interviews I’ve done, today’s topic is the one I knew the least about off-rip. On the flip side, that also meant I got to learn the most. Sometimes the best thing to do is to listen, and ask questions, which is what a good interviewer should be doing anyway.

This week, I reached out to my friend and former classmate, Rebecca Gilmore, to talk about “three of her favorite things”—baking, beauty, and babies. Becky is a cosmetologist, baker, business manager, and full-time mother to a spry toddler based out of Columbus, Ohio. Among her friends, Becky is known for her high energy and joyful personality. She has the uncanny gift of making anybody she’s talking to instantly feel better about life. The following is the account of a live 90-minute interview conducted in person. The interview begins with a personal narrative and progresses to address each topic in general terms. Becky’s responses stand out for their candor, insight, and experience. FYI, you can find her on Instagram @RebeccaShannan

[For a complete archive of interviews, click here.]

Tell the people a little about yourself.

My name is Rebecca Gilmore. I have been married for almost 5 years now. I have a sweet baby named James. I’m on sabbatical with James right now, which a lot of people don’t know. That’s been really nice. I love cooking. I love baking. I love all things family-oriented, especially during the holiday season. The holidays are my favorite time of year.

Take us through your journey in the world of baking and cosmetology. How did you get started, and where are you today?

Technically, I never wanted to do cosmetology. Growing up, everyone in my family—my mom, my grandma, my aunt, and my sister Brittney—really loved cosmetology. My grandma had a hair school in Trinidad, which is where my mom and dad met. My mom and dad opened a number of salons in Trinidad, and we had just opened one up in Ohio, because that was Brittney’s dream. I kind of wanted to be different, so that’s where baking came into play. In high school, I did a lot of baking, and I really enjoyed it. However, when I was a senior, my aunt ended up getting sick, and Brittney took over my aunt’s duties as the main manager of the salon. Brittney was already working full-time behind the chair. She started losing a lot of her hair from the stress. We also had about 3 employees quit around the same time. My sister needed help.

I felt bad. I was already contributing to the salon. I would clean, work the reception, and do little things here and there. I was familiar with salon life. It was the world I had grown up around. It just wasn’t my passion, and it wasn’t where I saw myself going. My dad didn’t force anything on me. He asked me if this is what I wanted to do, or whether I wanted to do baking instead. I ultimately decided that I would do cosmetology for a few years to help out Brittney at the salon, and later on in life I would do baking and pastries. I was comfortable with numbers, so taking on those additional manager duties—bills, payroll, inventory, taxes—wasn’t that big a deal.

For the next step, I completed an 1800-hour program in a year and a half to get my license as a managing cosmetologist. Meanwhile, I worked at the salon part-time, continuing my administrative role and helping to service clients. Cosmetology students would intern toward the end of the program, and so the salon is where I knocked that requirement out, as well. On many days, I would attend cosmetology school from 8 to 4. And then I would go to the salon from 4 to 9. When I graduated, the salon became a full-time thing. I worked Monday through Saturday from open around 9 AM to close. If we had a late client, we would stay until 9, 10, or even 11 PM, and so it was very common to work 12-hr+ days, 5-6 days a week.

Did you have an idea in mind early on how you were going to pursue your baking dreams?

My original plan was to go to Le Cordon Bleu in Paris. Le Cordon Bleu is a famous culinary school, and I wanted to attend their baking and pastry division. I had actually gotten scouted from a Le Cordon Bleu rep from Chicago when I was 13 or 14. He just so happened to be friends with another friend that I had baked a cake for. He couldn’t believe I was so young making these fancy cakes. He said “When you graduate, contact me, and I’d love to get you in the Chicago Cordon Bleu.” I wanted to go big or go home. I didn’t want to stay in Chicago or anywhere local. I wanted to go to Paris. I was 17 when I graduated high school. My parents wanted me to wait a few years before going to a foreign country, and that is what I intended to do.   

When you’re young, you think, “I want to get away from family. I don’t want to be local. I want to go do my own thing—to be big and bad and on my own.” As an adult now, I’m thankful for how my parents handled the situation. They didn’t squash my dreams. They were very supportive. They said they would figure out the means. But I’m also glad they didn’t allow me to do whatever I wanted at the time. I’d be so terrified knowing what life would have been like being in another country away from my family at 17 years old.

You mentioned that you started baking at a young age. Who were some of your biggest influences? 

I think my baking more so came from Grandma Suzan. My grandma was definitely a Jane of all trades. Anything she wanted to do, she would do. There were random weekends where if she wanted to bake a cake, she would bake a cake. When we lived in Trinidad, she and I would pipe frosting roses by hand versus using a bag. After we moved to the US, she would come visit for the holidays, and we would play games and decorate cute little cakes. My mom also cooked and baked with us. When I was 11 or 12, she signed me up for classes on baking at Michaels. She wanted me to keep busy during the summer. I also used to bake cheesecakes with my grandpa John. However, none of my family members ever baked professionally.

It’s quite common for people to have an interest in learning how to cook, but fewer people have an interest in learning how to bake. What inspired you to excel at both?

I’ve always loved baking a little more because everything has to be very precise. The ingredients are to the tee—every gram has to be accounted for. Whereas cooking is more “throw a little bit of this, “throw a little more of that,” and is based more on your personal senses. With baking, it’s so strict. Being off by a couple of grams here and there can really affect how something turns out. That being said, one recipe can be made several different ways just by changing butter to lard, or milk to buttermilk, or almond milk to regular milk.

As far as cooking, our mom never wanted us to be scared in the kitchen. She wanted us to grow up being able to feed our families and hold down the fort in our homes. She wanted us all to know how to cook and bake all the basic things. Even at 4, 5, 6 years old, she would have us in the kitchen, watching and helping and handing her things. I think that’s where my love for it originated—watching her do what she did—and teaching us how to feed and take care of a family.

What advice would you give someone who wants to get better at these artistic skills?

Professionally, I would say listen to your demographic. What you perceive as art or perfection can be different than what another person perceives. Really pay attention to the feedback you get from your clientele and focus on providing them what they want.

Recreationally, everyone’s art field is so different. What I view as art may be different from what you view as art. Just because it isn’t the normal or standard, that doesn’t mean it’s not good. Keep doing what you love and makes you happy, and don’t be afraid to try new things. A lot of people are used to being in their comfort zone. It’s nice to try new things because cooking and baking are not permanent, nor is hair. You can always change it.

I also think one art field translates into many art fields. Grandma Suzan, for example, would also make clothes just because she wanted do. Cosmetology, cooking, baking—and other arts, like painting, which I love—give you the opportunity to show your passion. To experiment with different things in order to achieve a certain result.

When did the salon become a permanent thing?

The salon became a forever thing when Brittney and I decided to purchase our own building instead of lease. At that point, I had been a cosmetologist for 3 or 4 years. Before my dad purchased the building, he asked Brittney and me if this is what we wanted to continue doing, and if I wanted to begin pursuing my baking and pastry dreams. By that point, I had already traveled because of cosmetology. I had been to Australia. I had been to London. I went all around the United States, doing hair and makeup. I had also become attached to my clientele. They were my family, and I couldn’t see myself leaving America to pursue a once-was dream.

A couple years ago, you welcomed your first child into the world. James will be three in February. How did that experience change you?  

Becoming a mother changed not only my personal life, but also my view on what’s important in the work-field. You want to provide for your kids and work as much as possible, but not at the expense of missing out on experiencing them. Instead of working 60-hour weeks at the salon, I opted for working fewer hours to be present with James. I also figured out how I can make more money in the hours that I was working to still be able to provide for my family. I still ordered products, did the taxes, payroll, helped with cleaning, and reorganizing, but I was not working behind the chair anymore. I stopped doing clients, and I made James the priority.

What is the hardest part about being the mother of a toddler?

The tantrums. With James having special needs, it does make things a little more exaggerated. James was diagnosed with spastic quadriplegic cerebral palsy. I always feel bad punishing him, because I don’t know if that’s his way of expressing himself. Sometimes it’s hard to figure out whether you’re crushing your child’s spirit, or rightly correcting them for doing something bad. Jamesy is a great baby, and he rarely ever has tantrums, so that makes life easy.

What about the most rewarding?

Every single day. His smile and his laughter is literally the best thing. Watching him hit every single goal that they’re working on in therapy is so rewarding.

What advice, support, or encouragement would you give to new mothers?

There’s so much advice to give to new mothers, but at the same time, I think a lot of people tell moms that it has to be done this way or that way, and that’s not correct. Every mom’s journey is going to be different, and it’s a learning process as we all go. But one thing I would recommend is getting Vitamin D. Walking outside, sitting outside, and doing outdoor activities can help with post-partum depression. I think the reason I didn’t suffer from it is because I spent a lot of time outdoors. The Vitamin D and fresh air made me feel so much better.  

I would also say to get yourself ready every morning. It’s easy to say, “I don’t have time to take a shower, to put on makeup, to work out,” because your #1 priority at that point is your child. You are their living life source, especially if you’re breastfeeding. You’re at the mercy of the child. But one thing my husband always made sure was that I took care of myself first, because you can’t pour from an empty cup. He would always tell me that. When you take care of yourself, even if it’s just 30 minutes, you feel better about life, and you can then give so much more to your child and family.  

Today, how do you balance between baking, beauty, and taking care of the little one?

Right now, with me being on sabbatical from work, I focus on James. With the holidays in full swing, it’s beauty season, so I’ve been stopping in the salon here and there to help out the girls. That’s how I get my beauty fix. The holiday season is also the best time for baking and cooking, especially traditional food—like spiral-baked ham, homemade bread, sweet bread, fruit cake, pastels, etc. Yesterday, for example, I cooked and baked almost everything for Thanksgiving—turkey, ham, green bean casserole, mashed potatoes, mac n’ cheese, stuffing, cranberry salsa—and I really enjoyed it. I love it when people eat the food I make. For James’s birthday, I’ll probably make a huge cake and cupcakes. During the holiday, I love to gift food, whether it’s an actual meal or baking item. I also make cakes and desserts throughout the year for friends’ birthdays.

When COVID hit, my husband worked from home for 7 weeks, and those were literally the 7 best weeks of my life. We got to cook and bake and work out and do whatever we wanted every day, and we got to spend so much time together with James. Right now, our weekends are constantly being pushed around all over the place, running here and there. But those 7 weeks were literally just us. It was amazing. We had no cares in the world. When my sister retired from the salon, I had no choice but to go back full-time to keep the business running. Looking back, I’m kind of sad I did it, because I made work a higher priority than spending time with James, but I know God makes everything work out for good in the end.

In general, to balance between many different passions, you have to be really precise with your free time. For example, I meal prep now. When you are intentional about it, you waste a lot less time, food, and energy in the process.

What are some of your biggest goals moving forward?

Beauty-wise, I want to get back into a more regular routine at the salon, whether that’s 1 or 2 days a week. My next big baking goal is James’s third birthday party. It’s going to be Trolls-themed. It’s going to be lots of fun colors, cotton candy type-food, and all the flavors. I really want to try an orange creamsicle cupcake for his birthday and another cupcake that involves cotton candy in some way. Since it’s not until February, I still have time to figure everything out. Whatever it is, I know it’ll be delicious.

Recently, I dabbled in the thought of opening a coffee shop. I could sell baked goods there. I think that would be really fun, but it’s a lot of work, so we’ll pin it for now.

I’m going to ask you several questions in quick succession. You can limit your answers to no more than a few words or sentences.

Favorite beauty brand?

I don’t have one, but my two most loved ones are Too Faced and Makeup Forever.

Favorite national cuisine?

Trinidadian. But I also really like Middle Eastern food.

Favorite thing to cook or bake?

Pies. And I love to cook chile because it’s quick and easy and super delicious. I dabble into homemade pasta, as well.

Favorite comfort food?

Curried crab.

Favorite guilty pleasure?

Screamo music.

Favorite TV show?

I like anything that involves sci-fi or stupid comedy like New Girl and Stranger Things and Rick and Morty. They are like three completely different shows, and I like all three of them.

Most useless talent you have?

Organizing a fridge. I learned this one from one of my clients.

If you had to move, what city or country would you choose?

Trinidad or Colorado Springs, Colorado.

Dream job if money were not a factor?

Bartender. I think the main reason is for the people. Think of all the people you could talk to and learn their life story.

On a scale of 1-10, how much do you love Ohio?

I only love it an 8 because of friends and family. Everything else can go, starting with the weather.

Motto or saying to live by?

I have like three posters that say, “It is well with my soul.” What it means to me is that no matter what life throws at you, God will be there to bring you peace and comfort.

One thing people don’t know about you?

That I like to do contract work. I love home improvement and DIYs.

Does pineapple belong on pizza, yes or no?

Yes. A thousand percent.

On “Hot Ones,” the host Sean Evans likes to close his interviews with, “Tell me what’s new and exciting in your life.” I know this is one of your favorite phrases. So, before I let you go, tell the people what’s new and exciting in your life. 

James is starting pre-school in March. As far as the coffee shop adventures, we will see where those take me. We are also actively looking into building a new house, which is super exciting, because it would be our forever home. The new house would be an open-ranch style, which is a lot more suitable for James. I want low taxes, and I want two to five acres of land for James to run around in. I also really want a dog, but I can’t have a dog right now because of the pond in my backyard. I plan to add a very large kitchen to the new build and have all my baking dreams come true.

The pandemic has prompted a surge in cooking as people spend more time at home and are wary of going out. Some have taken up cooking as a hobby, while others have resorted to it as something even more vital. I myself have spent more time in the kitchen since the pandemic broke out, spatula and saltshaker in hand, than the rest of my life put together. I find cooking to be viscerally satisfying and an opportunity to create meaningful experiences with those around me. Growth in this area has beyond doubt been one of the pandemic’s biggest legacies in my life.

This backstory motivated me to reach out to my friend and travel companion, Frankie Isabelle. When he isn’t doing bicep curls or philosophizing about the state of world affairs, there is a good probability you can find Frankie in the kitchen cooking up some fire. Frankie has a reputation in our friend group as “the best cook of the bunch” and is known for making lavish preparations, complete with herbal tea, spice-induced aromatherapy, and ethnic cuisine. He contends that if cooking for you is all about the eating, then you may be missing the point. Frankie shares his experience, gleaned from his upbringing, travel, and observation, that could transform the way you view one of planet earth’s most ancient arts.

Tell the people a little bit about your background.

I’m the oldest of three brothers. I come from a Mediterranean background. My mother’s family is Lebanese. My father’s family is Italian and Irish. A friend of mine always jokes that the Irish are the only Mediterranean people north of France. I was born in strip-mall hell, Columbus, Ohio, which was really not such a bad place before all the yuppie gentrification projections turned the city into a giant shopping mall. These days they say that Columbus will be a Smart City. I guess that means it will have dumb residents.

In some Middle Eastern households, the kitchen is considered a feminine space. How does that stereotype square with your experience growing up in the US with an ethnically Lebanese mom?

I have never experienced the kitchen as a strictly feminine space. One thing I have noticed with the women in my family is that they do not like anyone near the kitchen when they are cooking. Asides from this, my mom was the breakfast specialist, and my father seemed to enjoy cooking, as well. In any case, he was always the grill master, and often cooked dinner. Growing up, both of my parents worked long hours, and I often had to fend for myself. Nevertheless, I do appreciate when people make me food, and I feel especially gratified when a woman makes me food.

When I was 17 years-old—and with the infinite wisdom of a 17 year-old—I decided to become a vegan. Nobody in my family was very interested in cooking vegan. Fortunately for me, Lebanese cuisine is easily adapted to a vegan diet, so I didn’t have a very difficult time at family meals. I’m talking about Loubieh bi Zeit (green beans in olive oil); Tabbouleh (vegetarian salad); Fattoush (bread-based salad); Bamieh (okra); and Warak Enab (stuffed grape leaves)—all mainstays of any Levantine kitchen. The problem was that this food was never enough to maintain my weight, and so I had to learn creative strategies for satisfying my body’s needs. This is where my interest in cooking really took off.

Most people assume that vegans are health-conscious people. All right–fair enough–but that doesn’t mean they want to eat limp kale for every meal. So, the question for me was really, how I do I create savory dishes that pack the same punch as animal based foods? Now that I’m no longer vegan, I still love to cook, but for a different reason: most of the Frankenfood for sale at restaurants and grocers has little nutritional value and is often toxic. Cooking our own food affords us greater control over the quality.

What makes a successful experience in the kitchen?

My best experiences in the kitchen are when I’m able to be creative with what’s at hand. And the only way for that to happen is to take risks, make mistakes, and improvise. With enough time you will be able to establish your preferred flavor profiles. My go-to consists of lemon, salt, pepper, onions, and garlic. As a cook, you will need to discover what combinations work best for you.

I do consult recipes because I am curious how certain things are made, but I am never constrained by them. A lot of people don’t cook because they lack the knowledge or are afraid to mess up, and there’s no excuse for either. If you feel uncomfortable, plan ahead so that you have what you need. Personally, I’ve never been a rule follower, and nobody in my family could ever give me any straightforward answers when I asked them how they made a particular dish. It was always, “I don’t know, I’ve made this my whole life,” or “a little bit of this and a pinch of that,” or “taste it as you go”.

For some people, cooking is transactional. They cook in order to eat. You, on the other hand, take a more holistic view. Can you speak to the psychological or social benefits of cooking?

When we develop the capacity to realize our desires in the world around us, we become more confident and aware of our own needs and interests. The same thing applies to cooking. Any time you eliminate the gap between production and consumption, you are moving in the direction of health.

The best part about cooking is the meal, and not just the eating. I use the word meal because it implies a social element. Sharing food is a way for us to reconnect with our communal nature and to make contact with other vital needs that are ignored or considered less than “essential” by the modern world. In my experience, the happiest cultures recognize the implicit connection between social harmony and shared meals. Take the Mediterranean world, for example. Hosts take the initiative, and guests are not allowed to self-serve. The goal is to establish a rapport and to break down the barriers that stand in the way of genuine connections. Would you like coffee or tea? How does the food taste? Is it salty enough? Sweet enough? Sour enough? In the context of a meal, valuable insight can be gained. Do they eat slow or fast? Do they put their elbows on the table? Are they particular or easygoing? And so, in these cultures, food and its prerequisites are a socially meaningful experience, and cooking can be a tool to create the connections that are so important to our well-being as a species.

You spent a part of this summer with the Amish. What did you take away from that experience?

I was struck first by the structured approach of the Amish. They pray before each meal starts and after each meal ends. They eat together, unlike most Americans. Compared to the Amish, my eating habits were a bit decadent, and I gained a reputation as something of a foodie. “You like to eat good, Frankie”, they always told me. I worked hard that summer, but I never took breaks shorter than an hour. Fortunately, the Amish like dessert, so they were also quite fond of afternoon naps.

To my mind, eating should be a pleasurable experience, not a mere transaction to gain the calories we need to survive. In the United States, there’s very little concept of quality. Everything is about quantity. We are always in a rush. And our relationship with food is mostly passive and consumptive. We have lost touch with what makes us feel good. And one of the things that makes us feel good is eating from our own labor and sharing the fruits of our effort with those around us. In the Arabic world, a greedy person is said to have a big stomach (baá¹­no kbir), while a virtuous person is said to “eat from his fatigue” (yakol min taÊ¿abo). This is something that is a lot easier to achieve on a farm, and it is one of the reason why I think the Amish are so content with their simple lifestyle.

What is your favorite dish to cook?

I don’t have a favorite dish, but my favorite utensil is bread. I love it, for example, when everyone eats from a common bowl or dish. Potlucks have a similar appeal. When we eat this way, we function in the context of other people and their needs, and this forces us to develop more self-awareness.

During the last year, a lot of people have taken up cooking as a hobby or cooked more due to the limitations of eating out. How has the pandemic affected your culinary habits? 

We saw the panic buying that took place. Every animal on the earth knows how to get food, except for people. When supply chains get disrupted, fear sets in. The Amish taught me a lot about hunting and agriculture. They know where food comes from because they live off of the land. Knowing how to produce your own food is not only empowering, it’s also vital to a well-lived life. There’s plenty of studies where lab animals demonstrate greater satisfaction upon acquiring their own food rather than having it delivered pre-packaged and pre-dosed. The less dependent I am on the marketplace, the more confident and healthy I feel.

What advice would you give people just learning how to cook or people with an interest in cooking but don’t know where to start?

Start with what you already know—everybody knows something—and cook only the meals that you like. If you cook something that you don’t like, either don’t cook it again or change how you prepare it. As you do this, your repertoire will expand. That’s it. If your really struggling, watch some videos online, and if you still can’t figure it out, you never will. Eat out or find a partner who likes to cook. You should also know every ingredient you put into your body. Stay away from processed foods.

The last thing I will say is if cooking feels like a chore, it’s probably because you are not working in harmony with your needs. You work mechanically and consume compulsively. This is a social problem that has no easy answers, and each person must find a solution suitable to their particular circumstances. Let food be your guide. If you have time to cook and share a meal, then you are moving in a direction of balance and stability. Lastly, don’t be so hard on yourself. Relax, and take your time.